Welcome to the Struggle Bubble. I'm Chad Kutting We're excited to be back for the second episode of this season. Special guest today Ricky Clarke. Ricky, thanks for joining us. Thanks guys, thanks for having me. I'm super excited. I've been listening to the podcast from afar. So when Craig asked me to jump on and have a chat, I was incredibly excited. So thanks for having me. I love it. It's been too long. I wanted to get you on season one, but you're a little bit busy in the professional world. So I'm glad we got around to it in season two. Yeah, so I was gonna say, so everyone gets a little bit of a background on who you are, what you've been up to, et cetera. I'll kind of kick us off. We've met, I don't know, about 15 years ago now. That's a long time. yeah. Long time ago, we were both coaching. were director of a camps company and that went a little belly up and then we all fell into Fremont Youth Soccer Club or we was it Mission Valley back then? MVU, right? a while, yeah. Yeah, and then we flipped it to Fremont. yeah, give us a bit of a, you know, we met all the way back then. You've obviously gone on from the youth game into the professional level, moved from Cali, a couple of locations. Just give the listeners a little bit of a background on you. Yeah, you know, just been just been really fortunate to live all throughout the US for 20 plus years now and working in the game at pretty much every level, whether it's youth development, coach education, collegiate game and and even on both sides at a professional level, working in the men's game and most recently in the women's game. So I've been really fortunate. You know, really sort of take high value in developing my craft and just consider myself a lifelong learner. I don't think you ever arrive. You're always on this sort of process or journey of self-development. And yeah, I'm onto a new stage now and I'm excited about what the future holds. No, you're being super nice, mate. You went and did ODP when that was a big thing at regional level. You went over to the men's game at Silverbacks, right, at Atlanta. So you did the men's, then you went on to Seattle Reign for a short stint, so you were back and forth. You'd already moved over to Atlanta. In between all of that, you did directing ECNL programs at Rage. And then obviously ECNL on the East, well, not really the East Coast. Coast, I worked in Atlanta, I worked in ECNL. Yeah, mean, listen, know, I've worked at, like I said, I've worked at every level of the game. I've been really fortunate, whether it's ECNL, whether it's the development academy on the boys side, MLS next. I've been really lucky at challenging myself in different environments, you know, and that's kind of one of the things that I talk to young coaches a lot about these days, you know, they're I get a lot of messages on social media, how do I get into the pro game? you know, one of the things I think that really served me well in my last two years where I was at Houston Dash was all the experiences leading up to those two years, having to deal with managing groups of staff, dealing with parents, being able to convey your message, being able to sell a message. And that all helps you for when you get into those environments, specifically like You know, high intensity environments, know, you're you're available to the public. You're seen in the public eye a little bit differently. And all those things prepared me for that environment, you know, and I think working and constantly trying to educate yourself, trying to develop yourself. That's what I've done along the way. And in that, what it allows you to do is it allows you to build a network as well. And I think building a network is a is a massive part of. growing as a coach. I don't think you can just put your head down and go full steam ahead. So just been really lucky to work at all the levels of the game and take my experiences with me. you say look at, I see how much you grind. So there's a relation and correlation in that, like you are constantly educating younger coaches, happy to take calls, meetings, et cetera. You're giving out all this free content on Instagram and LinkedIn, et cetera. So yeah, you can say it's look, but mate, I see how much you work. in the background to get to those lucky situations. And then even the work you did at Dash, mate, I mean, you were put in a pretty odd situation, right? And, you know, I'd say you came out smelling like roses. know, everyone I speak to in the professional game, right? Can't say, yeah, just great things about you, mate, honestly. So it's, again, it's good to have you on here. appreciate that. have to be so polite. You've done a lot in your career. You've worked your arse off and you've been successful. So you can say that. And I know Chad's dying to ask about eight year old soccer players. So he's gonna... I get growing every... got the main question, Craig. The main question is, you talk about the soccer network. He chose you as a friend. So I questioned the judgment of Ricky Clark, the younger, the 15 years ago. But as you guys started coaching together, we talked about the network before we jumped on Ricky. Describe a little bit like your mentality approaching that game and how you gravitate towards others in the game so that you build out that network and are able to bounce ideas off. Listen, I think I think the most important thing I've learned throughout the years is everyone's going to bring something different to your journey. And it's not always about like selecting what you agree with. Sometimes some of the biggest lessons I've learned are what I don't agree with when something's happened and how when I go on to a new challenge, I'm not going to take that with me or I'm not going to make that mistake again. So I think When you challenge yourself to work in different environments, build your network, not only does it help your knowledge as a coach grow, but it also helps you develop as a coach as well. You start to build references on this works for me, that doesn't work for me. I've seen that happen in a different environment. I'm going to try and do this in another environment and see if it works. So building those networks. Working at different levels as well. That's something I speak to coaches about all the time They want to make this like we live in this world now Which is sort of like an instant gratification world and they want to make these big jumps to the next level and I think The most important thing is learning in different environments stretching yourself Perhaps being uncomfortable in certain environments prepare you for whatever those next steps are So the more you can build that network the more as a coach you're gonna become sort of a well-rounded coach with experiences that are gonna prepare you for whatever your next challenge is. And that's vital for me. That's one of the key things I've learned as I've grown older. How do you, we have people listening that hear from you and other experts that have played at the highest level, coached at the highest level, and they're looking at how do you apply that at the younger level? Because it just seems really disconnected between, you see elite athletics or even at the high school level where everything is organized. and try and translate that down. So as you give that advice to the coaches, how do you also give that advice to the parents that are looking at developing their kids and focusing on the right things at the right time? Yeah, for me, to be honest with you, Chad, it all goes back to communication and organization, you know. So in January, I did a presentation for a group in Chicago where I spoke about the similarities between the pro game and the youth game. And there's so many, but the most important thing is communication. And sometimes people think, communication, you've got to like blast your message out. You got to tell everyone what you're doing. It's not actually how loud you speak, it's what you say that's important and how you break that up. You know, and I think how you deliver that message is really important. And that can be anything from constant daily messages, small messages to your parents, constant video clips that you're sending to players where you're using video clips to reinforce your message that you're delivering on the field. And those... Those steps are really important for me. What was unique about my last two years in Houston was when I became the interim manager, I plastered our message everywhere. So our training session was on every wall, every room you walked in. Our Dash codes was on every door when you opened the door to go in the building. So not only was the message being delivered by looking at stuff, but it was also being delivered by us and our actions daily, whether it was. When we did our meetings, were we on time to all our meetings? What we were, what information we were delivering at our meetings? Was it loads or was it just short, quick messages that were reinforced over and over again? So the message stayed consistent. So there's loads of different ways you can do it. And I think sometimes we, look at communication in this. need to tell everyone everything I know immediately and broadcast it. And sometimes it. That's not the way sometimes communicating is getting there early so you can have a five minute conversation with a couple of players before practice starts or leave like finishing and then spending five minutes talking to parents, just delivering a message about the playlist that you send on Hudl for example. So the more you can communicate and now there's so many tools in the world. to help you do that. You know, we were just talking before about chat GPT. I use that religiously. I don't have shame in doing that. I speak to people and they're like, my God, you use that? Are you afraid people are going to? No, I'm not. I'm not afraid at all. If there's a tool that allows me to be efficient and deliver my message quickly and concisely to people, then I'm going to use it. The thing I love about chat GPT is it's your thoughts. So you put in a message and it provides exactly the message that you want to deliver and you can manipulate it and change it. So these days when you speak to people and they say, well, I didn't have time or I didn't get around to that. Well, there's tools now that allow you to be able to do that. And it's sort of like this sort of no, no excuse environment, you know, but communications, the biggest one when you're dealing with parents, even when you're dealing with younger players. And then when you're dealing with coaches, because it's a connection between all of them. don't think, you know, I always talk about this triangle effect when you're working in youth soccer. If I'm talking to the player and telling the player what to do, but I don't tell the parent what to do, then the kid goes home and the parent starts talking about something completely different that they saw. And then the kid gets confused and thinks, maybe that's the way I should be doing it. Right. Because ultimately, the players gonna listen to their parent over the coach. I don't care what anyone says there. So for me, there's little ways that you can get around that. Like I always do majority of the time, I do a half time team talk with my parents. So I bring the team in over to the parents. We sit down with the parents and we do our team talk together and people look at me like I'm crazy. But what it does is it aligns the parents back with our objectives. Hey, before the game, we spoke about A, B and C. We did A and B. We need to try and a little bit harder at C. Parents keep an eye out for that in the second half. So all of sudden, they've not gone looking at a bigger picture and start identifying things that are not important to me as a coach. So again, the way that I'm communicating is I'm communicating to the players before the game, but then I'm bringing the parents in to make sure we're all on the same page. So then when they go home, and they start talking about the game, because they do, as much as you tell them not to, they do. They'll say, hey, remember what Coach Ricky said at half time when he spoke about A and B? You guys did C as well in the second half. And your message stays on point. It doesn't get drawn away. Now, every now and again, let's have an honest moment, every now and again, people are gonna see what they wanna see. But as long as I create a structure and an environment where the message is being delivered constantly, and with a purpose, then the more efficient I'm going to be and the more my message gets delivered powerfully. Yeah, I think that's key, mate, because there's a lot of times, it also comes not from just the coach. The club's gotta do that as well. The club's gotta have alignment to support the coach, what they're doing, et cetera, but also at the end of the day, and we'll probably get into this a bit more, but we're a managed service. Right, but at end of the day, there's a membership that goes to that club that delivers a service and where the people giving that service is in the coaching. So you've got to give that full circle communication of this is where we are today, this is where we're trying to get to, this is what we're doing, et cetera, et cetera. And just touch on the chat GPT, I love it. I finish a game, I open my phone, I talk about the game into my phone and ask it to just analyze and give me a game review. lights out. Used to take me hours, now it takes me seconds. Yeah, for sure. I think to Ricky's point in that, Craig, and you've done a fantastic job communicating within our soccer community of what to look for is you need to have the passion to do that. It's still your voice and you want to, why are you out there? You want to make everybody better. You want to make your team better. That's not just wins and losses, that's development. So by creating the transparency and having the passion to create the transparency, Ricky, think it's amazing to have the parents in there. listening because the game of telephone is very real. I asked my daughter, did coach say at practice today? I don't What did, I mean, all the kids, what does coach want you to do this game? What do need to focus on? When it becomes a shared language, it's so much easier to understand what to look for because the measuring stick for these kids in grade school, in high school, in the pros, sometimes gets, it's very small. The difference between what they're doing and what another player isn't doing. or what the coach is asking for and what they are or are not doing. So being very specific and very consistent with the message is massive. Yeah, no, for sure. You know, we talk about language a lot as well, you know, the language that you use is really powerful. And sometimes when you come from a different environment and you step into a new environment, the language is different and it's not aligned with what they've been used to. So I talk a lot about language and send a lot of information to parents about language. Like I'm working in a youth program. just near my house at the moment. And yesterday I sent just like a flyer basically saying, hey, these are the key terms you hear me saying all the time. This is exactly what they mean. So when they see it or when they hear it, they know what I'm addressing the players to. And again, there's so much learning that takes place outside the field. You can only affect players so much in the time that you have them. It's like, how do we create an environment where learning takes place when you're not even there? And also by educating the parents, you create this streamline event of everyone being on the same page. some parents, again, some parents have an idea of what the game looks like or what it should look like. And I'm fortunate enough that I've spent 20 plus years in this environment. I think it's almost 25, but I keep hanging on to 20. And I've seen all the different levels and I've seen the mistakes that I've made. I've seen the moments where I've been successful, I've managed to improve an environment. And I think that part's really important. But it goes back to the passion. You I think you have to want to do it. I think a lot of the times when I speak to coaches, they're like, I'm not comfortable with technology, nor was I. Nor was I comfortable with technology. But I also realized that if I'm going to continue to grow as a coach, that technology is going to be a part of my journey. And if I don't, then I'm going to be left behind to a certain degree. So you have to, that's another part of your growth as a coach, stretching yourself to do things that you're perhaps not quite comfortable with as well. Well, that should always be the stick, right? You gotta just keep putting yourself to your point, right? You gotta be comfortable with being uncomfortable. Be that tech, be that on the field, whatever that is. And there's another point, right? There's that part about the education side of it, but also accountability. That's one thing I'm struggling with with a few, you know. I see the game, right? I'm out there at the weekends and I'm coaches all over the place and I'm like, God, just. I don't want to say be more professional, because that's when it goes back to education, right? Are you doing, there's one thing, there's an education standpoint around doing your qualifications, ongoing education, et cetera. But there's also that professionalism of, you know, be there early, set up. And even if it's not perfect, just that energy and effort, it goes a long way. I struggle with that sometimes as well, looking at some of the, to your point earlier, Rickett, of like, hey, I'm gonna be a ECNL coach. All right, well. This is the path to get there and it's gonna take some time, right? And you kinda gotta coach your way up. Do your qualifications, do everything that's needed to get to that point. But they wanna get there so fast, they don't give a shit about team four that they're coaching now and getting those kids better. They just wanna get to team one and I struggle with that a little bit because you and I, we've been through the ranks for sure, right? And you just make kids better and you enjoy it. But again, it's professionalism, it's energy, it's the effort, it's the education. put into it and just one other thing about education. I changed my evaluation system this year, right? I didn't like giving out pieces of paper, one, two, three. I'm a big stickler on like, don't grade kids like we grade meat. A, B, C, dude, like, you gotta have a conversation. And one thing I did this year different to the years past was. I only, and this is eight year olds, so just to give you I actually gave the evaluation to them with the parents in the room and the questions were directed to the player and then to me. And it was all about trying to get in the head of a seven and eight year old, right? When I say technical, what does that mean? I've to do step overs. Hold on. No. That is part of a technical skill set, but what I'm talking about, when I say we gotta be more technical, I'm talking about receiving the ball correctly, or using your back foot instead of whatever it is, and that's switching the kid's head. was massive for me. And we talk about, one of my players, talk about flow state. When you're running with a ball, you're in such a flow state that you can carve and cut people and get to goal. So now when she hears me say flow state, she knows she's in the right movement. But if I'm not saying that, she's realizing, hey, I've got to be more technical, sharper on the ball, move the ball quicker. Like I'm not in that running position. It was a big game changer for me of doing evals different than I've ever done before and just getting directly into to the psychological side of those kids. And even the parents were like, wow, okay, this is different than we've, normally it's a piece of paper, right? Like you get from school. So that education part is real big for me as well. Yeah, I mean, for me, one of the biggest challenges is Craig is like that. That for me is the art of coaching, right? That you can go from one environment where you're working. I was listening to your show last week. You're working with high school kids and then you go into another environment where you're working with eight year olds and you can recognize that there has to be a difference in the way that you communicate in those environments. And that for me is like the art of coaching. I think now. too often you go on Instagram or you go on social media and you watch people, they watch Pep Guardiola shouting and screaming at his players. And they think that's the energy and the intensity you need to bring to that environment. And it's really for me, the challenge of being able to step out of one environment and go into another environment and change, completely change the way that you react. And that's self-awareness. That's one of the things I learned probably when I was in Houston. how to be more self-aware. One environment demands this and another environment might demand a completely different Ricky. And I need to be able to recognize that and change or adapt within that environment. But when you're working with young kids, it's this environment where you need to realize who you're working with and what that environment requires. And that's key. what's that, you you say you're working with a youth club local now, like how does that shift from professional women, right, and from ages from what, 21, 22, if you straight out of college, all the way up to... yeah. Yeah, so you've got a 10 to 15 year gap potentially between an age group of players, all professional. You've got a 21 year old trying to show their worth, get next year's contract, et cetera. And then you've got an ex-pro, or someone who's been in the league 10 plus years, like... We just lost our head coach. We've got an interim assistant coach now leading it, right? And you and I have had conversations about this. And I've talked, you know, a good friend of the show, right? Leslie and Ricky, right? I talk to them a lot about this. like those levels, because Ricky's career ended a little sooner than Leslie's, and Leslie went on and did this and that. You got, again, these young kids coming out of college, trying to prove your worth, trying to get to next year's contract, with the old pros like, eh, I'll get to pre-season when I'm ready. So you've done that, and now you've gone back down to the youth level, like that's a pretty big, you got man management skillsets here. and now you're back into youth development, like how have you dealt with that shift? Yeah, I mean, it's been, to be honest with you, it's been fun, know? Like one of the things that you said to me before was, you know, at the start I said I'm unlucky to have worked at every level, right? And in a way, I'm not lucky. I do work incredibly hard. I take real pride in being able to step away from the best women's league in the world and coach 11-year-old girls who have their shorts on back to front, So. For me, I take great pride in being able to do that, you know, but I also realized along the way there's a lot of similarities in how you work with players, you know, just communicating constantly with players and being honest with them is so key. And whether that's you're working with somebody who's been an international player and they've played at the highest level in the world, they've played at a World Cup or if that's your like... working with a 10 or an 11 year old, how you communicate with them and the constant communication you give them is gonna build that trust. And I think trust is another thing. Trust is not something that happens overnight. like perhaps one of the challenges I have right now stepping into the youth environment is the kids don't know me. So there's this sort of like, not a disconnect, they're still trying to understand who I am. I'm trying to understand who they are. And trust occurs over time with small little behaviors over time. It's not, hey, you asked me a question and I give you my response. I trust this guy now. He's telling me what he thinks. Trust is reinforcing good behaviors, talking to them, being open, allowing them to ask you questions when they don't quite understand what you're telling them. And these things are like similarities between the two. environments. When I'm working with elite players, hey, I want you to do this. What happens if this person comes inside? What do I do? Well, what do you think? What would you think would be the best challenge? And hey, we're trying to play out the back and where do you think the best space is? Well, I want to play it right down the middle. OK, if you play it right down the middle, what are some of the challenges? What might intercept it? All right, well, let's see. You try and look for the best option. So all these things that are communication tools that you're using as a coach and they can work in any environment you step in. And I think that's, it goes back to what I was saying before, it's the art of coaching. It's knowing what to do, when to do it and where to do it, what environment you're in. And that comes with experience, Craig. Like you said, we've both been lucky to work at all different parts of the ladder. And all that comes with, experience and being on the field and working with different age groups, working in different environments. Yeah, that's funny you say that. Somebody asked me the other day, so what we learned today, I'm like, well, your eight year old can tie their shoe now. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Ricky, when you talk about the timing and knowing how to coach, there's a battle in all sports of how actively you coach during a game versus how actively you coach during a practice. Where do you stand on the psychology of how much impact you can have on active coaching on the sideline during that game time versus saving it for instruction in the practice zone? That's a great question Chad because that's one thing right now I find myself doing a lot more than I normally would because I'm new to the environment so I'm constantly within games trying to talk to them and and not tell them what to do but just like hey we're building out the back what what what should our shape look like so I'm giving out little pieces of information to players but I also use like different tools to coach within the game. Just not just me communicating to players on the field. Like when they come off, I have a little tactical board and we go through and we move players. Hey, when this player's in that position, where should you be? They move the players while the game's going on. Like I use the substitution moments as opportunities for learning moments. So that part's an ongoing process. I would hope I get to a point where there's not as much information being delivered in the game, but in the short space of time I've had them, I've had to perhaps be a little bit more, give them more information during games. But a lot of that comes from also within training sessions, like how much time you have with them within training sessions. Kids have multiple sports that they're playing. Sometimes, you know, like this week I've seen some kids for an hour and a half and we've got four games at a weekend. Like in reality, unless I bring a magic wand with me, what am I going to be able to like completely pull out within an hour and a half training session? So that goes back to how you reinforce and communicate off the field. like this morning before you guys actually sent out a couple of huddle playlists, hey, these are really good things we saw in the games last week. Just to remind that these are the things we're looking for this weekend. So even if I haven't seen a player, they also see the There are things that are really important to me this weekend. And that's no different than what I was doing in the pro game. At a certain level, there was more information being promoted to them. There was more information being given to them, but I see them every day. But we sent playlists. We would have individual player meetings where we would talk about things that we want to see at the weekend. We would give them like little handouts. for their IDPs, individual development program notes that we would want to see at the weekend. It's just a different scale that you're delivering and communicating that information on. How helpful is active coaching from parents on the sidelines during the game? Yeah, I think it goes back to what I was saying before. What I find as a coach, like if I include them in that process, you don't feel it as much or you don't see it or you don't hear it as much. I think the one thing I learned as a young coach was I'm really good. I've done my coaching qualifications. You need to listen to me. And as I got older, what I realized was if I convinced them of what I'm doing and there's different ways to convince them, whether it's speaking to them at halftime, speaking to them before the game, sending them constant little nuggets of information via email, it makes those conversations on the sideline less and less. They occur every now and again. And what I try and do is I just try and address it. I just try and address it straight away. I don't let it keep going on. I don't let it keep dragging on. And then I just remind them, hey, look, this is what we're trying to do. This is what it looks like. This is the message. To Craig's point, Craig mentioned, he added a really good point when he said, it's only so much a coach can do. If there's not a blanket message from the club in terms of your values and your objectives, then it becomes a, I wouldn't say challenging, but it becomes more of a difficult process for the coach to constantly fight on their own. You know, just reinforcing the club values, reinforcing the club objectives. makes it easier for the coach when communicating and trying to avoid those types of interactions during a game. Yeah, it's such a good question, Chad because you shouted at me across the field last week. You be very clear what happened, Craig. You shouted at a player telling, what did you tell her? Tell her to shoot? No, no, no, no, no. I shouted her name because she was space cadetting out on the wing instead of coming back and help defend. to your point, Ricky if I shout the kid's name, it's like training an animal, right? They know my tones. If I shout at a level that's high enough pitch, realize there's something going on that they've got to react to. So I shouted her name and she's like, yeah, I'm space cadetting. I've got to get back and defend. But it was pretty loud and... he was very loud and I'm at the other side. I had just gotten yelled at by the referee for standing and watching the game. So I'm in the corner, I've got both of my kids, twins are playing in the same location, field side by side, so I'm just tennis matched back and forth. So I'm at the corner and a corner kick was about to happen, referee goes right at me. Is there gonna be a problem over here? And I swear to God, I look behind me. Like, what is he talking about? If it's gonna be a problem, let me know. And then a couple minutes later, Craig starts shouting across. He's being way too loud. I scream back, keep it down. He screams back, shut up. Referee looks at both of us like, man, I don't know what to do. Do I throw them both out? Yeah, to be fair, that for the eight-year-old soccer game, that referee wanted the balls at the perfect PSI. I'm like, this is going to be an interesting one. there you go. You know that when that happens. To your point though, Craig, to your point, like we have like little words that ignite like moments with players. Like we use the phrase, or I use the phrase, light bulb. So I say, Craig, light bulb. And then all of sudden she knows, right, well, do we have the ball or do we not have the ball? And when I first started working with a group, like... I was on the sideline and parents heard me shout, light bulb, but they must've thought, what's happening here? Like, what were we paying for here? But in reality, it's actually a word that uses the players to get more organized and think about the game instead of shouting and screaming directions at them. As soon as they hear light bulb, they know, oops, switch on, where am I? What should I be doing? What should I be focusing on? And we use that at the pro level. You know, we lose the ball, we used to say we lose the ball, light bulb, what shall I be doing? You know, and it's... It's amazing with those cues and we talk a bit, you know, just child psychology. As a coach, you need to understand the psychology of where that kid is mentally during that game. They could have had something that happened at school that morning or they fought with a sibling or they woke up on the wrong side. You just don't know. So to have the little, the trigger words that are able to bring them back into the moment, to get into the flow that Craig, you you've talked about before is huge. And it's little bit of a trick instead of that. When we were growing up, it was just screaming. You just heard a coach from the sideline, get in the game, what are you doing? And then you hear it on the car ride home. It shifted the way that we approach these kids. coach is normally a parent as well from when we played so it was even harsher. I need to, hold on, I need to ask a question on this because you guys went through alphabet soup earlier in this call and I get lost. So we got ECNL and GA and God knows what other things going on. The state of soccer right now, how do we as non-soccer, I'm a baseball and football guy, as a non-soccer parent trying to get our kids set up, what words are we looking for? What are the programs that we were looking for? How do we? assess what is happening because going back to communication I have no idea what it means to be on an ECNL track or a GA track or an MLS next track or all the other nonsense that you guys are talking Hmm. Look at each other who wants to take it? Got it. No, listen, you know, this is either either theory on this that's there's there's so many it takes a little bit of homework from the parents end but I have a theory on it in respects that everyone wants to play at a highest level and when you're in competitive sports, you're in competitive sports because you're competitive and you don't just want to play and have fun like you're in competitive sports because you're you're competitive and there's element of you that wants to be at the highest level. What I would say though is the environment is key in developing your daughter or your son, but the most important part of that is the coach. And I think sometimes that gets lost in when you're like when you're searching for the environment to be in, because I know so many kids that have made a jump and gone to ECNL or gone to MLS Next and the environment is perhaps a really good environment for them, but the coach is a terrible fit and they're not experienced that level or they're a completely different coach to their child or they don't treat their child the way they should be in that environment. And I have thoughts on that because that's also a great opportunity for a child to learn about real life, not really getting what you want. But it's about finding the environment where you have the right coach that's going to treat your child properly and challenge your child and you as a parent also trust in that person. I think sometimes we go into environments to play at a higher level thinking that's going to be way better for my daughter or my son. I'm going to get a much better coach. I'm going to get much better competition and that's just not the case. It's not the case. Sometimes and you have to do the research as your parent going into that environment I had a conversation with a with a parent the other day who'd gone to a higher environment and now they've dropped down a level and how they said it was so much more beneficial for their son and how he was enjoying the game more even though he loved playing at that higher level now is in an environment where the coach is still challenging him, but he's still got the sort of similar level of competition so I think is about really doing your homework going into that environment. I'm sure Craig has thoughts on that. and I was just gonna add to it, you're also talking about certain age groups as well, right? You could be talking about an 11-year-old that wants to go into an ECNL program, doesn't know, you know, where to go or what to do, and I've always said this, For me anyway, what's on your chest isn't as big a deal as who's actually doing the coaching. Then that goes to the league status, right? But I do massively agree, and this is where it's a little bit kind of gray, is if you want to be competitive, you've got to be in that correct environment for you, wherever that is in the process. And at 10, all of us as coaches would never say, we can tell you you're going to make pro. None of us know, right? So the timing of all of this is also key to it. Then, We have an epidemic issue of you have to be ECNL now to go to college. Do you? Like that's not true. Also to go past one that I want to be a pro. Well, we're signing 14, 15 year olds in the NWSL of us now going pro. So. I think the landscape's changing as well. And then the last point to that is, this is my biggest pet peeve, is certain leagues advertise certain things to draw players in, then they fill rosters to 22, 26, and your kid only gets 25 minutes. Well, let me tell you, you ain't getting a college scholarship that you think you're gonna get that 0.01 % actually get. Playing 25 minutes on an ECNLGA, it doesn't matter what the acronym is. Hmm. Don't matter, you may as well go back to where you were or when you were happy to your point, Ricker. Like, go with a coach that's gonna give you everything you need, the time on the field, the training, environment, everything. You have a higher chance of getting somewhere under that banner than joining a random program with the acronym that you like and only getting 25 minutes on the field. And I talk about this with our high school kids all the time. The biggest thing for me there, Craig, that you said as well is playing, actually playing, you know, especially from a young age, because the young ages are such key parts of their development pillar. And if they're not playing as much or they're spending 30 minutes on the bench and they're playing for 30 minutes, they're not going to improve. They need to be in an environment where they get multiple opportunities to play and be on the field. So yeah, it's... I would just say to people it's about doing homework as well. know people who have left and gone to other clubs and they're like, I didn't realize that's their style of play. I didn't realize their coach only trained them twice a week and then they worked with somebody else for twice a week. You know, it's just about doing homework and realizing when you go to another level, you're going to make a different commitment and you've got to be prepared for that. Yeah, yeah, and that goes back to communication by the way, like I've had a big, you know, where we are I'm like, hey, we got to talk more to the parents. Like, you know, you're signing up for GA, which is what we're in, right? Because you're going to Clovis in Sacramento three times a year. And if that's not right for you, that's okay. Like, go to team two or whatever. but I can't show up with 11 players thinking that we're gonna be successful. Simple as that. So it's hard. So Ricky, you're on the struggle bubble and we like to ask this question and we can focus on any level in any part of the last 25 years that you've been in soccer, in football. What do you see as the biggest struggle as a coach? I think coaching's changed a lot. You know, I think from when I first started coaching to where I am now, it's, it's a completely different environment. You know, and one of the things I said before was with technology, you have to be prepared to embrace technology if you're going to continue to grow as a coach. And I think just continually evolving as a coach, you know, like I was on a course recently and someone said to me, why are you on this course? Like you just. coached in the NWSL and I was like, well, I want to get better. And I had this conversation with my wife all the time. She's like, well, don't need to do that anymore. Like you've, you've, you've coached at the highest level and it would be like, no, I need to, I need to keep improving, figuring out ways I can develop as a coach. So for me, I think when I first started coaching, there wasn't like a coaching software to design your sessions. There wasn't like video software where every kid now, their touch of the ball gets trapped. Like that, that part would have destroyed me as a kid. I think if I could see every touch of the ball I had in the game, right? So it's like, how, how do you, but then that also requires something else differently from you, Chad. It's not just now about going out on the field and running a training session and having the cones in the right place. It's like, how do you learn to communicate about the video clips that you're sending. How do you send? What video clips do you send? What message do you deliver if you send a certain video clip? So now as a coach, not only do you just have to be a good coach on the field, you have to be comfortable managing people. You have to be able to communicate to people like people who have a conversation and they say, I'm the coach. Like that's it. Right? You listen to me, I'm the coach. I'm vehemently going to disagree with them because that is not how it works. Like you're part of this ecosystem and process that is helping players, young players or even older players grow and develop. And that takes a whole lot of skill sets and different tools nowadays than it did even when I was, you know, 20 when I first come to the States and it's making me feel old saying that because that's normally what old people say. But, you know, it's true. It's really true. You know, I think about it now. I think to myself, how can I deliver pieces of information to the players? Like I was thinking this morning, how do I deliver this information to the players that sounds cool? How can I deliver a message that sounds cool? Can I deliver a point and say, hey, you know this, add in something like, sounds like this song. and they're related to a new current song that's trending at the moment. So it's like as a coach, you're constantly trying to figure out ways where you become relatable. know one that we've been doing a lot is we kind of stole it from basketball a little bit is that every kid has a certain handshake or whatever. It's worked pretty cool because the kids are excited to get on the field and be the first in line to kind of greet you as such. That's been pretty cool to see it kind of evolve and then we're always talking about, look, new drip, new boots. And like the kids. Yeah. their mind because you're talking at their level but you're old because we are old and they're you know, it's kind of interesting but be Yeah part, you know, that point to that question is like it always changes. You're constantly changing how you communicate the world we live in how you people within the world communicate. it's like as a coach, I need to like be at the forefront of that. And some people don't want to do that, Chad. That's OK. Some people just want to turn out. They want to run a training session. They want to collect their money and they want to go home and They want to go and have dinner with their wife or that's okay. But you also realize you're only going to get a certain degree of like success out of that approach in my opinion. I mean, Ricky, you've hit on so many great points of the, if you have the pride in the game, the passion of the game, the love of the game, the desire to get better. I you've hit on all of the things that we try and instill in our kids and our coaches in the leagues that we help run. And that's where it comes down to. And I think as league administrators, if you're at the top of that, you're running a league or you're doing coaching training, finding ways to create that motivation is also key so that people see that the hard work is being put in. So every time I interact with a coach, with a teacher, with anybody in public service, it's that gratitude because you know how hard it is to be in that position, but to take the ownership and accountability in that spot so that you're getting the most out of yourself and out of your players. It's hard nowadays because there is that expectation of instant gratification. Mm-hmm Yeah Yeah, yeah, I think I think sometimes Like you it's also those are also the teaching moments as well because yeah, you did do in practice Yeah, you did try in the game and it didn't work, but you're also playing against someone who's better than you And sometimes you don't, people don't want to hear that. Parents don't want to hear that. Players don't want to hear that. But that's also a life skill. Like I know there's better coaches than me. You know, so as I've got older, I'm like, all right, what do need to do to get better? And hopefully those moments are the things that we try and install in the players. It didn't work for you now, but if you keep trying and you keep working the small wins over time, that's how you build trust. Going back to what I was saying before. And that's how you build confidence in the player as well. Yeah. Right, hold on, Chad, before we go, Forrest or Chelsea are going to get that Champions League position, Well, I I didn't know you as a Forrest fan, mate, because you never spoke about him for years. And now, now all of sudden, now all of sudden they've had one good season, Chad. All of a sudden, I've got like multiple friends who have reminded me they're Forrest fans. Whereas with Chelsea, I think over the last 20 years, we've won 22 trophies, but I'm not counting. So for us, it's all about the journey, Craig, you know, like we've rebuilt the club and rebuilt the the style and I think we will get there eventually. If you guys want a season where you play Champions League, you can have it. Be nice, I've only been waiting 31 years. well, 30 years, yeah. just don't crumble at the end because that'll kill you. That'll be a heartbreaker if you crumble at the end. Because then if you do crumble at the end, Chelsea are just going to and in and in I'm going to pick up the phone and say, look, we had this podcast. You remember that moment? It's going to be really hard for you. Yeah, For sure. games, that's all we gotta do. Nine, by the way, what a turnaround, also mean, I mean, that's the fun thing about the game right now. You talk about like the game evolving, like every team now has money and has good players. And to be a coach in that environment now, you can see it with Man City. Like you, you have to be constantly evolving, constantly building because there's teams that are just going to continue to get better and better. Even Newcastle, you know, I love watching. I don't want my my good friends to hear this, Michael and Paul, but I love watching Newcastle play. They're big Newcastle fans and they're a completely different team now. the Premier League's a fun league to watch for sure. Mate, I put myself in that situation sometimes of like, how would you even coach at that level? Right, and I know, you know, little wins, et cetera, you get there over time, the pressure every single game and every week to make sure you don't get relegated or you're going for the champion, whatever it is, right? You're like, my God. And again, right, we talk about this at high school a lot when kids are looking for scholarships. I'm like, you're one bad tackle away. from an injury, right, which changes the landscape. Look at City, right, one player out, one injury out, and your whole season, it looked like their season just crumbled within one game. It's mental. I know we've been on here a while. I'm conscious of your time, but I think one of the things that I learned in my two years in Houston is you do feel pressure. You go into this environment where, you know, you're on TV every weekend. You see the best players, you coach against the best coaches. And one of the things that I think that environment taught me was you have to be able to forget about all that pressure. and focus on like who you are and what's really important to you. like when I become the interim head coach, I just went really narrow on what my core values were and what they helped drive me and how I made decisions, how I picked teams, how I picked out tactics. Because if you let all the stuff outside you affect you, you can just get pulled all over the place. And I think at that level, that was an even higher level. At Dash, we had games where we had 20,000 fans. And at times, you never knew there was five people in the building because you're so focused. But every week, that schedule, that environment, that pressure, you have to be incredibly disciplined to just focus on what's important to you, very close to the people around you you're working with, and focus on those objectives. and try and maintain how you're gonna keep evolving and developing those things moving forwards. Because if you let the pressure get to you, then like I said, you can get pulled all over the place, stick to your core values and what drives you as an individual. Ricky, I'm always fascinated in this, because we've talked about imposter syndrome at work and in the clubs that we run and everything. You become interim head coach, right? You're the head, you're the guy everybody's looking for. What is the first thing you think of or do in that moment? You know, for me, for me, initially it started in an acting basis. So the head coach was away. So I was the acting head coach. And then further on in the season, he left the club and then I become the interim head coach. So I'd gone through this sort of phase of leading the team thinking, oh, you know, next week, I'm going to be back to being an assistant. So what you try and do in that phase is just maintain what's been going on. You don't try and change a lot because you're not in charge. You just try and maintain the environment. And then when I became the interim head coach, I really just sort of threw myself into, you need to lead this group. You need to develop your communication. You need to develop your message. You need to develop your style, what you want the group to do. And again, that goes back to what I saying before. I kind of led with my core values, being kind, being curious and being relentless. You know, kind is the small wins. We were in a tough space, but any time there was small wins, really, I really bit into that. I really chewed on that and went after those small wins. And then being curious, right? What, trying to figure out what's not working. Is there another way that we can do this? Can we play a different system? Can we do something different to change the trajectory of where we're at? And we did that. We changed our system at one point towards the back end of the season. And then the relentless part is turning up every day. Like I was the first person in the building. I was the last person to leave the building. And I think through those actions, people see and buy into you as an individual. You also have to find the balance. Don't get me wrong. You know, one of the challenges is like taking care of yourself physically. That was a challenge for me because of the heat in Houston and the travel and being in different time zones all the time. So you have to find a way of balancing that, but your relentless nature of trying to solve problems, trying to be the one constant, trying to be the first in the building and the last to leave, were all the things that I think make me a unique individual. And I don't say that with an ego. I say that as that's who I believe I am. I'm curious, I'm relentless, and I like to think I'm kind, you know? And kind is... can be seen in different ways. Sometimes people see kind as a weakness. Kind can be telling somebody they tried something and it didn't work, but I'm really proud of you. That's me being kind to you. So I really tried to lead with those three core values in that environment, Chad. And along the way, you know, I made mistakes. I'm not going to say I was perfect, but there was also a lot of stuff that you see in the media that we did incredibly well, you know? So for me, I enjoyed every minute of it. Houston's an incredible organization. had a massive, still have a massive place in my heart for the organization, the players and the staff that were there. A lot of the staff stayed. So I enjoyed every minute of it, but you talk about like, being in it in the struggle bubble. I was in the struggle bubble there for six months. I enjoyed every minute of it. Just if there was one regret of mine, I did it without my wife and my dog. My dog, I come home after Houston. I was home for four days and we had to put my dog down. She was 12 and a half. And that was probably one of the hardest things I'd ever done. And not having my wife with me. along the way being in Houston, she was living in Atlanta and I was living in Houston. That was a tremendous strain, I think, on me personally, away from the field. So, but I'm back now and, you know, I was watching something the other day, I was watching an interview the other day, I can't remember where it was and they were like, you know, what's next? What are going to do next? What, know, and the person said, be where your feet are. And that's like really hit home to me, you know, I'm at home, I got a new pup now, a little George, spending more more time with my wife. I'm enjoying being home and I'm just trying to enjoy being where my feet are. That's good. It's good advice mate. Awesome advice. Ricky, we've really enjoyed this conversation. I want to give you the opportunity, where can we find more of Ricky Clark's wisdom with soccer? Yeah, no, I'm on Instagram a lot. That's sort of the place where I've built my network and built a following. So if you just search Ricky Master Coach on Instagram, you'll find me, but I'm on all different social platforms. I pop up in different spaces every now and again. Excellent. We will attach links to our social media and onto this episode. Ricky, really appreciate you taking the time to sit with both of us on the struggle bubble. For everybody listening, continue to follow us on social media. We're on the struggle bubble pod. We'll post some links to places you can find all the great content that Ricky has talked about. For Craig and myself, appreciate you coming on board today. And for everyone else, we'll see you in a couple of weeks. Next week in the week and a half is spring break. So don't know how many episodes we'll have. I'm going to be on the surfboard somewhere. Thanks guys. Awesome. I appreciate it, Ricky. Thanks, everybody.